[HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site

Wed Jan 22 16:48:19 PST 2020

Ah, so perhaps what Rob referred to was 100yd away is actually uphill (south), which is about where the SECAST tower site is at where AF7PR’s DMR repeater is located.  Be aware that the SECAST tower is barely visible from North Bend, ie may not be LOS for 5GHz coverage, but it may also benefit with a client facing a future cell site on the supposed DNR tower, along with others  a few miles away down below on the valley floor?  It would be good to see your video, perhaps you can put it on YouTube or a cloud drive with a URL?

I noticed that the E Tiger HamWan (cell site?) heat map shows coverage W & S, but pretty much nothing E toward Rattlesnake.  Is that because of directional antenna(s), or topography?

Stephen W9SK

From: PSDR <psdr-bounces at hamwan.org> On Behalf Of Kenny Richards
Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 2020 3:50 PM
To: Puget Sound Data Ring <psdr at hamwan.org>
Subject: Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site

The Rattlesnake project that Rob referenced already on the HamWAN books is getting AF7PR's repeater backed by HamWAN. I have some video from the top of the DMR tower (where the existing HamWAN client is located) of what is visible from that location. 

Thanks

Kenny

On Wed, Jan 22, 2020 at 3:33 PM Stephen Kangas <stephen at kangas.com <mailto:stephen at kangas.com> > wrote:

Thanks mucho, Rob for your reply & info.

The idea of putting a client site up there is my own cockamany idea, based on what I interpreted would be the best thing to do after doing some reading at HamWan.org and other websites.  I am at the moment simply exploring, gathering info, etc, to develop a proposal for our local ARES teams that serve the cities of North Bend and Snoqualmie, including emcomm in both EOC and in field locations in this area.  I was figuring a cell site would be correct architecture to reach a wider area here, given the height of Rattlesnake mountain and the success we’ve enjoyed with both FM analog and DMR repeaters up there serving a good coverage are.

The objective is primarily a reliability of emergency communications, including repeater linkage (especially PNW DMR linked repeaters) for our volunteer emcomm hams working in the field individually, with first responders (eg Eastside Fire & Rescue, local police, our local hospital, etc), doing windshield surveys, plus, voice and internet for city EOCs to bolster WinLink etc.  Presumably the EOCs and certain home sites would have HamWan clients, in some cases making meshing possible.

However, if there is a better architecture for this, please suggest another option(s).  Keep in mind that our people are on a valley floor surrounded by many tall hills, and mountains.  There is no LOS between the EOCs of the cities of North Bend and Snoqualmie; in fact, although this needs to be confirmed, I suspect there is no LOS between the City of Snoqualmie EOC and the top of Rattlesnake for 5GHz, given their EOC is at their fire station located essentially at the intersection of Snoqualmie Parkway at WA 202 in the trees.  On the other hand, the City of North Bend’s EOC is LOS from top of Rattlesnake, with a 25ft tower to give them an edge.

I am hopeful that our NBAT group who serves North Bend may be able to secure some funding from them, currently intended for a 70cm voice repeater at their EOC tower, and perhaps we can squeeze in something to hire a tower climber and some other items to add HamWan up at Rattlesnake.  A road not quite traveled yet, in part because I’m still gathering info for the final emcomm proposal.

I’m curious about what other sites are only 100yds downhill away, as I’m not aware of any except the WA state site to the east that is used primarily by Washington State Patrol; is that what you are talking about?  

There are three other tower sites directly south from the location you worked at, belonging to Bonneville Power Admin, AT&T Wireless (for cell service, they are about the only party leasing space on that private tower), and a small tower/shack site owned by SECAST on land they rent from DNR (where the local Rattlesnake DMR repeater is located along with others).  We would love to see the Rattlesnake DMR repeater (owned by AF7PR) on a HamWan link as backup to the inet DSL link running over to the AT&T tower next door.  I was part of a volunteer workparty that did some repairs and maintenance at the SECAST site last July, which is when I took those photos (I have other pix of the other sites, too).  That is when I learned about the various site owners there.

So, consider this preliminary conversation I’m instigating from my end, exploring best options, coming from a position of relative HamWan ignorance, so you guys can set me straight.  😉

Best, Stephen W9SK

From: PSDR <psdr-bounces at hamwan.org <mailto:psdr-bounces at hamwan.org> > On Behalf Of Rob Salsgiver
Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 2020 1:17 PM
To: 'Puget Sound Data Ring' <psdr at hamwan.org <mailto:psdr at hamwan.org> >
Subject: Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site

Stephen,

Thanks for the notes.  Kenny, Tom, and I worked on the initial connection up there this last summer.  In your first photo, it’s on the middle tower.  At the moment it’s only a client dish and the original intent was/is to connect that site and a neighboring site down the hill about 100 yards away.  The 2nd site is on the list for projects when the weather clears.  This is the first I’ve heard of putting a full cell site up there, which certainly would change things a bit.  Can you tell me where the full site discussions originated from?  I’m curious to find out if it’s expected to go into/onto the tower we are currently on or a different location, who the contact would be, etc.   I’m trying to get projects mapped out and prioritized for the coming year and the more info we have sooner, the better.

FWIW, here is a LOS map looking north from our current tower position:

And here is a rough look to the south and west:

Keep in touch as we get into the new year.  I would be good to coordinate any new work with the project already going on there if possible.

Cheers,

Rob

From: PSDR [mailto:psdr-bounces at hamwan.org] On Behalf Of Stephen Kangas
Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 2020 12:23 PM
To: psdr at hamwan.org <mailto:psdr at hamwan.org> 
Subject: Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site

Oops, attachment challenged today.  Now attached photos.

From: Stephen Kangas <stephen at kangas.com <mailto:stephen at kangas.com> > 
Sent: Wednesday, January 22, 2020 12:22 PM
To: 'psdr at hamwan.org <mailto:psdr at hamwan.org> ' <psdr at hamwan.org <mailto:psdr at hamwan.org> >
Subject: Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site

In follow up to the Kiwi chat conversation with @EO_...

Attached are a couple photos related to two of the 7 communications site towers adjacent to each other on Rattlesnake.  Four of those are clustered together in a small spot: PSE, King County, USFS, and possibly DNR.  These photos were taken in July 2019, and the USFS site appears abandoned in that cluster.  One of these photos shows the towers for King County and what is possibly DNR, but I don’t recall exactly which one is which, perhaps you can ID (my impression is that KC is the taller of the two).  The taller of these two happened to have a sign on its shack with lat/lon coordinates on it, which is shown in the second photo.  Interestingly, those coords places a Google maps marker at the edge of the forest clearing a couple hundred feet away from the entire cluster, perhaps because the coords are not precise enough.  Both of these towers have a clear view of North Bend and Snoqualmie Ridge IMO, although as EO_ pointed out the HamWan link from Haystack or wherever may need to be at the very top.

I will be exploring the possibility of getting volunteer certified tower climbing help for a workparty proposal to you this coming spring/summer when the road there is passable.

On a separate note, King County supposedly also owns the tower site at I-90 exit 38 Tinkham Road that should be LOS to their Rattlesnake site, and may be a possible hop towards getting over Snoqualmie Pass and eventually eastern WA in the future?  Given their involvement in WA EMD and Cascadia prep, perhaps they would be amenable.  There is a tower on top of nearby Grouse Ridge (next to the Fire Training Academy, and an old now unused site on Mount Washington that could be investigated as hop sites, both accessible by roads in summer.  Just a thought.

Stephen (eeeehaw)

Stephen Kangas W9SK

Public Information Officer

North Bend Amateur Radio Emergency Services Team (NBAT) NB7AT

North Bend, WA (CN97)

stephen at kangas.com <mailto:stephen at kangas.com> 

425-503-9876

NBAT is an all-volunteer non-profit serving the City of North Bend during emergencies and public service events.  

When all else fails…Amateur Radio

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