[HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site

Wed Jan 22 17:19:17 PST 2020

Stephen,

The reason the existing HamWAN client was installed on the DNR tower was to
work around the height/LOS limitations of the tower where AF7PR's repeater
is located. Multiple HamWAN installations are visible from the current
client's installation point. The plan is to install a special PtP link to
get the connectivity between the DNR site (where the client is installed)
and the AF7PR DMR repeater building.

E. Tiger only has a single Sector installed, so there is only 120degree
coverage.

Thanks
Kenny

On Wed, Jan 22, 2020 at 4:49 PM Stephen Kangas <stephen at kangas.com> wrote:

> Ah, so perhaps what Rob referred to was 100yd away is actually uphill
> (south), which is about where the SECAST tower site is at where AF7PR’s DMR
> repeater is located.  Be aware that the SECAST tower is barely visible from
> North Bend, ie may not be LOS for 5GHz coverage, but it may also benefit
> with a client facing a future cell site on the supposed DNR tower, along
> with others  a few miles away down below on the valley floor?  It would be
> good to see your video, perhaps you can put it on YouTube or a cloud drive
> with a URL?
>
>
>
> I noticed that the E Tiger HamWan (cell site?) heat map shows coverage W &
> S, but pretty much nothing E toward Rattlesnake.  Is that because of
> directional antenna(s), or topography?
>
>
>
> Stephen W9SK
>
>
>
> *From:* PSDR <psdr-bounces at hamwan.org> *On Behalf Of *Kenny Richards
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 22, 2020 3:50 PM
> *To:* Puget Sound Data Ring <psdr at hamwan.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site
>
>
>
> The Rattlesnake project that Rob referenced already on the HamWAN books is
> getting AF7PR's repeater backed by HamWAN. I have some video from the top
> of the DMR tower (where the existing HamWAN client is located) of what is
> visible from that location.
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Kenny
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 22, 2020 at 3:33 PM Stephen Kangas <stephen at kangas.com> wrote:
>
> Thanks mucho, Rob for your reply & info.
>
>
>
> The idea of putting a client site up there is my own cockamany idea, based
> on what I interpreted would be the best thing to do after doing some
> reading at HamWan.org and other websites.  I am at the moment simply
> exploring, gathering info, etc, to develop a proposal for our local ARES
> teams that serve the cities of North Bend and Snoqualmie, including emcomm
> in both EOC and in field locations in this area.  I was figuring a cell
> site would be correct architecture to reach a wider area here, given the
> height of Rattlesnake mountain and the success we’ve enjoyed with both FM
> analog and DMR repeaters up there serving a good coverage are.
>
>
>
> The objective is primarily a reliability of emergency communications,
> including repeater linkage (especially PNW DMR linked repeaters) for our
> volunteer emcomm hams working in the field individually, with first
> responders (eg Eastside Fire & Rescue, local police, our local hospital,
> etc), doing windshield surveys, plus, voice and internet for city EOCs to
> bolster WinLink etc.  Presumably the EOCs and certain home sites would have
> HamWan clients, in some cases making meshing possible.
>
>
>
> However, if there is a better architecture for this, please suggest
> another option(s).  Keep in mind that our people are on a valley floor
> surrounded by many tall hills, and mountains.  There is no LOS between the
> EOCs of the cities of North Bend and Snoqualmie; in fact, although this
> needs to be confirmed, I suspect there is no LOS between the City of
> Snoqualmie EOC and the top of Rattlesnake for 5GHz, given their EOC is at
> their fire station located essentially at the intersection of Snoqualmie
> Parkway at WA 202 in the trees.  On the other hand, the City of North
> Bend’s EOC is LOS from top of Rattlesnake, with a 25ft tower to give them
> an edge.
>
>
>
> I am hopeful that our NBAT group who serves North Bend may be able to
> secure some funding from them, currently intended for a 70cm voice repeater
> at their EOC tower, and perhaps we can squeeze in something to hire a tower
> climber and some other items to add HamWan up at Rattlesnake.  A road not
> quite traveled yet, in part because I’m still gathering info for the final
> emcomm proposal.
>
>
>
> I’m curious about what other sites are only 100yds downhill away, as I’m
> not aware of any except the WA state site to the east that is used
> primarily by Washington State Patrol; is that what you are talking about?
>
>
>
> There are three other tower sites directly south from the location you
> worked at, belonging to Bonneville Power Admin, AT&T Wireless (for cell
> service, they are about the only party leasing space on that private
> tower), and a small tower/shack site owned by SECAST on land they rent from
> DNR (where the local Rattlesnake DMR repeater is located along with
> others).  We would love to see the Rattlesnake DMR repeater (owned by
> AF7PR) on a HamWan link as backup to the inet DSL link running over to the
> AT&T tower next door.  I was part of a volunteer workparty that did some
> repairs and maintenance at the SECAST site last July, which is when I took
> those photos (I have other pix of the other sites, too).  That is when I
> learned about the various site owners there.
>
>
>
> So, consider this preliminary conversation I’m instigating from my end,
> exploring best options, coming from a position of relative HamWan
> ignorance, so you guys can set me straight.  😉
>
>
>
> Best, Stephen W9SK
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* PSDR <psdr-bounces at hamwan.org> *On Behalf Of *Rob Salsgiver
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 22, 2020 1:17 PM
> *To:* 'Puget Sound Data Ring' <psdr at hamwan.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site
>
>
>
> Stephen,
>
>
>
> Thanks for the notes.  Kenny, Tom, and I worked on the initial connection
> up there this last summer.  In your first photo, it’s on the middle tower.
> At the moment it’s only a client dish and the original intent was/is to
> connect that site and a neighboring site down the hill about 100 yards
> away.  The 2nd site is on the list for projects when the weather clears.
> This is the first I’ve heard of putting a full cell site up there, which
> certainly would change things a bit.  Can you tell me where the full site
> discussions originated from?  I’m curious to find out if it’s expected to
> go into/onto the tower we are currently on or a different location, who the
> contact would be, etc.   I’m trying to get projects mapped out and
> prioritized for the coming year and the more info we have sooner, the
> better.
>
>
>
> FWIW, here is a LOS map looking north from our current tower position:
>
>
>
> And here is a rough look to the south and west:
>
>
>
> Keep in touch as we get into the new year.  I would be good to coordinate
> any new work with the project already going on there if possible.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rob
>
>
>
> *From:* PSDR [mailto:psdr-bounces at hamwan.org <psdr-bounces at hamwan.org>] *On
> Behalf Of *Stephen Kangas
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 22, 2020 12:23 PM
> *To:* psdr at hamwan.org
> *Subject:* Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site
>
>
>
> Oops, attachment challenged today.  Now attached photos.
>
>
>
> *From:* Stephen Kangas <stephen at kangas.com>
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 22, 2020 12:22 PM
> *To:* 'psdr at hamwan.org' <psdr at hamwan.org>
> *Subject:* Rattlesnake Mtn HamWan cell site
>
>
>
> In follow up to the Kiwi chat conversation with @EO_...
>
>
>
> Attached are a couple photos related to two of the 7 communications site
> towers adjacent to each other on Rattlesnake.  Four of those are clustered
> together in a small spot: PSE, King County, USFS, and possibly DNR.  These
> photos were taken in July 2019, and the USFS site appears abandoned in that
> cluster.  One of these photos shows the towers for King County and what is
> possibly DNR, but I don’t recall exactly which one is which, perhaps you
> can ID (my impression is that KC is the taller of the two).  The taller of
> these two happened to have a sign on its shack with lat/lon coordinates on
> it, which is shown in the second photo.  Interestingly, those coords places
> a Google maps marker at the edge of the forest clearing a couple hundred
> feet away from the entire cluster, perhaps because the coords are not
> precise enough.  Both of these towers have a clear view of North Bend and
> Snoqualmie Ridge IMO, although as EO_ pointed out the HamWan link from
> Haystack or wherever may need to be at the very top.
>
>
>
> I will be exploring the possibility of getting volunteer certified tower
> climbing help for a workparty proposal to you this coming spring/summer
> when the road there is passable.
>
>
>
> On a separate note, King County supposedly also owns the tower site at
> I-90 exit 38 Tinkham Road that should be LOS to their Rattlesnake site, and
> may be a possible hop towards getting over Snoqualmie Pass and eventually
> eastern WA in the future?  Given their involvement in WA EMD and Cascadia
> prep, perhaps they would be amenable.  There is a tower on top of nearby
> Grouse Ridge (next to the Fire Training Academy, and an old now unused site
> on Mount Washington that could be investigated as hop sites, both
> accessible by roads in summer.  Just a thought.
>
>
>
> Stephen (eeeehaw)
>
>
>
> Stephen Kangas W9SK
>
> Public Information Officer
>
> North Bend Amateur Radio Emergency Services Team (NBAT) NB7AT
>
> North Bend, WA (CN97)
>
> stephen at kangas.com
>
> 425-503-9876
>
>
>
> NBAT is an all-volunteer non-profit serving the City of North Bend during
> emergencies and public service events.
>
> *When all else fails…Amateur Radio*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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