[HamWAN PSDR] system usage

Wed Feb 13 08:31:05 PST 2013

They are trying to software to get below the part 15 in 2.4 Ghz .   The -1
channel.

Steve N0FPF

On Wed, Feb 13, 2013 at 7:57 AM, Rob Salsgiver <rob at quailsoftltd.net> wrote:

> Short answer – I did read the mission <g>.  ****
>
> ** **
>
> In this instance I had no knowledge of Seattle vs NW Mesh and looked up
> the wrong one.****
>
> ** **
>
> There are will still be the need to make ongoing distinctions though, and
> your long answer even can create some situations where the line would be
> blurred.   As an example – using hamWAN as an Internet survival backup for
> amateur purposes is one thing – i.e. – during a disaster contacting another
> ham or looking up information on a website.  Shopping via hamWAN on the
> other hand, crosses the commerce line – i.e. – you can’t order a pizza on
> ham radio.  ****
>
> ** **
>
> I see this as one of those ongoing conversations that will probably be
> more of an issue as we get started than once things “firm up”.   Once we
> start having some demonstrated amateur  uses it will help illustrate the
> drawn lines.****
>
> ** **
>
> Rob****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* PSDR [mailto:psdr-bounces at hamwan.org] *On Behalf Of *Bart Kus
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 13, 2013 12:06 AM
>
> *To:* Puget Sound Data Ring
> *Subject:* Re: [HamWAN PSDR] system usage****
>
> ** **
>
> An excellent point to bring up, and one I've struggled with in the past as
> well.
>
>
> Short answer: read Article 0<https://www.hamwan.org/t/tiki-index.php?page=Constitution&structure=HamWAN#Article_0_Mission>of the
> Constitution<https://www.hamwan.org/t/tiki-index.php?page=Constitution&structure=HamWAN>.
> It describes HamWAN's mission.
>
> Longer answer with rationale for HamWAN's mission:
>
> A useful and vibrant computer network is one that allows like-minded
> people to communicate together.  In the case of the Internet, we have the
> ultimate wide deployment across geographical regions and social groups.  It
> is everywhere and provided to everyone.  From there, you see communities
> forming around their collective commonalities.  Topic-specific message
> boards, mailing lists, IRC channels, web sites/apps, etc.  We cannot hope
> to compete with the speed of terabit fiber-optics, or the budgets of global
> ISPs to be all things to all people.
>
> I, however, am a nerd.  And I enjoy the company of my fellow nerds.  It is
> these nerds that I would like to exchange data with.  I believe that
> passing a basic amateur radio license exam is a good filter for the quality
> of nerd that I'd like to see on the network.  Such a requirement also
> broadens the adoption of amateur radio itself in our society filled with
> computer nerds, who would love to play with digital networks, but don't
> have a ham license.  This is a good thing.  The compu-nerds might learn new
> things in the realm of radio along the way.  Voice net check-ins burn at my
> computer-literate soul, and the injection of computer-savvy nerds into the
> amateur radio hobby will fix these archaic procedures.  So there you have
> (part of) the rationale for requiring all participants to be licensed radio
> amateur operators.
>
> I'm also a bit of an independent.  Why should I put my communications
> needs solely in the hands of large corporations and the Internet?  Most of
> my communication is local.  I would be very happy to achieve independence
> from the corporate teat for at least my local communications needs.  On
> this kind of independent network, WE define the rules.  Comcast wants to
> charge $200/mo for a 50Mbit downlink feed.  I think we can beat that if we
> build it ourselves.  And make it symmetrical at the same time, so none of
> this 10Mbit uplink limit.  Nerds are not just consumers, they're also
> providers of data services.  The common Internet services target your
> typical mom & pop audience, who are dominantly consumers of data.  I'd love
> to live in a world where I can carry around a ham-phone<http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NinjaTel_Van>,
> my car is a mobile ham-hotspot, and my house is tied into the HamWAN, all
> at a significantly lower cost than the for-profit commercial offerings,
> while being tailored to my nerdy needs.  And there you have some rationale
> for "free digital communication" as a goal.  I can go on for quite a while
> on this subject.  :)
>
> I'm also a bit of a survivalist.  I like knowing exactly how my
> communications facilities work and how to fix them.  Should my Internet or
> cell service go down, I like knowing I have another completely independent
> system of communication.  The other emergency communications groups share
> this attitude, and it makes them great partners in building this network.
> These are the driving forces behind the emergency communications part of
> HamWAN's mission.
>
> Did I mention I'm a nerd? :)  Doing the R&D to bring this type of network
> to life is great fun.  A long focused effort by a group of nerds will (and
> already has) produced valuable results.  These need to be published so that
> others may benefit from our experience in building their own networks of
> this kind.  And there you have mission point #2, about conducting and
> publishing R&D.
>
> The publication of this knowledge also ties in with point #4, of educating
> and spreading knowledge.  Point #4 is also supported by requiring
> participants to pass ham exams.
>
> Lastly, I realize HamWAN will not be in control of all such like-minded
> networks.  These types of ideas (both technical and organizational/social)
> can spread like wildfire, and independent groups are sure to spring up.
> When groups' networks grow and start touching each other, I want to be sure
> they are compatible.  For this reason the last sentence of the mission
> statement is that HamWAN will act as a coordinator of interoperability.
> The recent decision to go with AMPRnet block registration solves a large
> part of the interoperability problem.  But there are other considerations,
> such as the universal adoption of the NV2 protocol which would make a
> roaming ham's equipment compatible with other groups' networks.  We may
> also have to implement an inter-network registration system for roaming
> hams.  There are analogous systems in the cellular telco world.  If we
> develop & establish a universal system of digital ham identity at least,
> that would go a long way even if we fail on the protocol adoption front.
> Someone suggested using the LoTW client certificate, which is not a bad
> idea at all.  ARRL provides a rigorous identity verification system in LoTW
> signup, although I'm not sure how good they are at expiring said certs in a
> timely manner should the registration lapse or be revoked by the FCC.
>
> Phew!  I'm out of words.  There's so much work ahead it's scary.  Recruiting
> recruiting recruiting recruiting<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMU0tzLwhbE>!
> There's no way I can implement the entirety of this vision for the future
> alone.
>
> --Bart
>
> On 2/12/2013 9:16 PM, Rob Salsgiver wrote:****
>
> Ok….. time for more questions, now that the marathon meeting is over <g>.*
> ***
>
>  ****
>
> A number of times I’ve heard potential uses that seem to blur the line
> between amateur and commercial, so my question is – how do we draw the line?
> ****
>
>  ****
>
> As an example – connecting to the Seattle MeshNet.  As I read it, the
> MeshNet is non-amateur.  Are we looking to be a generic carrier grade ISP?
> If so, then this will work, but we won’t be able to use amateur frequencies
> to do it.  Similar question for connecting firehalls down south – if we are
> sticking to strictly amateur uses, then the usage by laptops and other
> devices at a firehall would be limited to amateur related uses – i.e. – no
> non-hams using it.****
>
>  ****
>
> It may be that I’m just missing a big concept here, but I see a lot of
> blurring of the lines in conversation, and I think it needs to be better
> spelled out before we get in front of too many folks.****
>
>  ****
>
> I’ll stop with this one for now, rather than continue to show my ignorance
> and unfamiliarity <g>.****
>
>  ****
>
> Rob****
>
>
>
>
> ****
>
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> ** **
>
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