[HamWAN PSDR] VOTE: 900MHz service experiment
Bart Kus
me at bartk.us
Sun Mar 8 22:26:56 PDT 2015
Looks like we did $143.25 in Jan and $732.95 in Feb. There are several
non-recurring donations in Feb to help support Tukwila and these other
projects. It looks like the Jan figure is a good estimate of recurring
monthly cash flow.
At some point I also need to file a claim with Microsoft to match the
donations I've been making since we're a 501c3 now. Any other folks in
a similar position should do the same.
--Bart
On 3/8/2015 8:48 PM, Ryan Elliott Turner wrote:
> Before I vote, I'd like to learn more about our cashflows to ensure
> that the necessary credit could be promptly paid down. How much in
> donations was received last month, and how much in donations was
> received in February and March of 2014? I don't want to spend more on
> this than we earn in a quarter.
>
> On Sun, Mar 8, 2015 at 10:32 PM, Nigel Vander Houwen
> <nigel at nigelvh.com <mailto:nigel at nigelvh.com>> wrote:
>
> I agree with getting a long term antenna and one that continues
> our sectorized plan. YAY.
>
> Nigel
>
>> On Mar 8, 2015, at 12:30, Bart Kus <me at bartk.us
>> <mailto:me at bartk.us>> wrote:
>>
>> I didn't go, nor would I trust HamWAN money to sketchy antennas.
>>
>> I purchased the 3 modems recently approved (1 replacement 5GHz
>> and the 2 900MHz modems) and saved money by combining shipping.
>> There is $118.12 left in approved funds to get a 900MHz antenna
>> solution. Baltic is asking for *$204.59 to make the OD9-8
>> antenna happen* (shipping included). Laird's lower gain antennas
>> also have crazy high shipping costs, and they quickly approach
>> isotropic gain. I don't think it's a good idea to spend $125 on
>> shipping for what was supposed to be a low cost / low performance
>> test antenna. Longer-term, we would very likely employ a cross
>> polarized MIMO system since bandwidth @ 900MHz is very limited
>> and it's therefore important to maximize bit/Hz. There is only
>> one antenna on the market that I'm aware of that fits the bill:
>> Ubiquiti AM-9M13. It's a 13dBi 120 degree dual polarity sector.
>> I'm pretty sure they add the dBi from H+V polarizations to arrive
>> at 13dBi, so it's probably 10dBi / polarization. Still, 2dB
>> better than the 8dBi OD9-8. This antenna is physically smaller,
>> so the shipping is much cheaper. *It costs $278.36 shipped*.
>> We'll also need a pigtail cable to adapt from the RP-SMA
>> terminals on the antenna to the N-male on the modem.
>>
>> Now, there are a couple advantages to going this route:
>>
>> 1) We can re-use this antenna if we do deploy a 900MHz service
>> since it's the only one I'm aware of that fits the bill.
>> 2) The experimental phase can test both vertical and horizontal
>> polarity performance independently by simply switching a cable.
>>
>> So here's the modification:
>>
>> 1x Credit from removing OD9-8 = ($118.12)
>> 1x Ubiquiti AM-9M13 @ $252.00/ea = $252.00
>> 1x RP-SMA to N patch cable (1m) @ $9.95/ea = $9.95
>> 1x NF-NF barrel adapter @ $4.25/ea = $4.25
>> 1x Shipping @ $36.60 = $36.60
>>
>> *Total additional funds requested: **$184.68*
>>
>> If we don't end up doing a 900MHz service, or it doesn't use
>> these components, we'll return or eBay the parts and credit the
>> HamWAN balance.
>>
>> --Bart
>>
>>
>>
>> On 3/6/2015 7:59 PM, Tom Hayward wrote:
>>>
>>> Try the swap meet tomorrow?
>>>
>>> On Mar 6, 2015 7:55 PM, "Bart Kus" <me at bartk.us
>>> <mailto:me at bartk.us>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Turns out the shipping on that 8dBi vertical is $125.
>>>
>>> I'm open to suggestions at this point.
>>>
>>> --Bart
>>>
>>>
>>> On 3/6/2015 11:23 AM, Bart Kus wrote:
>>>> I just sent you all the relevant invoices.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, board! I guess I'm placing all the orders now.
>>>>
>>>> --Bart
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 3/6/2015 11:19 AM, Cory (NQ1E) wrote:
>>>>> Bart,
>>>>>
>>>>> I also vote YAY on the contingency that you get caught up
>>>>> on the paperwork. I still don't have the invoices on file
>>>>> from your last two purchases. ;)
>>>>>
>>>>> That makes it unanimous, so I guess the voting is complete.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Cory
>>>>> NQ1E
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 10:49 AM, Ryan Elliott Turner
>>>>> <ryan.e.t at gmail.com <mailto:ryan.e.t at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks, Bart. I vote yay.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2015 at 12:47 PM, gary.k7ek at yahoo.com
>>>>> <mailto:gary.k7ek at yahoo.com> <gary.k7ek at yahoo.com
>>>>> <mailto:gary.k7ek at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd be interested in experimenting with 900 mhz
>>>>> gear at my Spanaway residence, and possibly at my
>>>>> Graham Hill repeater site. I believe 900 mhz would
>>>>> provide better overall results than 5 Ghz, which
>>>>> proved to be marginal to barely usable during our
>>>>> recent site survey.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>
>>>>> Gary, K7EK
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE Smartphone
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Reply message -----
>>>>> From: "Bart Kus" <me at bartk.us <mailto:me at bartk.us>>
>>>>> To: "Puget Sound Data Ring" <psdr at hamwan.org
>>>>> <mailto:psdr at hamwan.org>>
>>>>> Subject: [HamWAN PSDR] VOTE: 900MHz service experiment
>>>>> Date: Fri, Mar 6, 2015 10:38
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>
>>>>> 5.9GHz is awesome when it works. The speeds are great, and it carries
>>>>> as far as the eye can see with very low ambient noise floor. It does
>>>>> however have problems when it needs to penetrate trees and buildings.
>>>>> To alleviate this, I'd like HamWAN to offer a slower but deeper
>>>>> penetrating 900MHz service. 900MHz is the lowest frequency ham band
>>>>> without bandwidth or modulation rate restrictions. Before we deploy a
>>>>> full cell site, I'd like to get some real-world experience with 900MHz
>>>>> penetration, propagation and ambient noise conditions. Here's the
>>>>> cheapest appropriate hardware we can use for this:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1x Vpol omni antenna @ $79.50/ea = $79.50
>>>>> (http://www.balticnetworks.com/laird-antenna-omni-8dbi-900mhz-n-female-integrated.html)
>>>>> 2x 9HPn modem @ $108.00/ea = $216.00
>>>>> (http://www.balticnetworks.com/mikrotik-metal-9hpn.html)
>>>>> 1x Shipping @ $UNKNOWN (quote not showing?! Need to call them.) =
>>>>> $40.00 ???
>>>>>
>>>>> Total: $335.50
>>>>>
>>>>> I already have a 900MHz high gain Yagi-Uda in my inventory and can use
>>>>> that to do various field tests. These can be directly compared against
>>>>> 5.9GHz performance since the gear will be deployed to one of our
>>>>> existing 5.9GHz cell sites. The results of such comparisons will give
>>>>> us a good idea of how well 900MHz might do for HamWAN.
>>>>>
>>>>> Disclaimer: These may not be the right modems or antennas for us
>>>>> long-term. A real deployment might use Ubiquiti Rocket M900 with their
>>>>> sector antennas. These Ubiquiti items are far more expensive though,
>>>>> and their software doesn't integrate as easily into our network, so for
>>>>> the purposes of the test I believe the set of hardware I proposed will
>>>>> do well at deploying fast and keeping costs down.
>>>>>
>>>>> NOTE: If both the votes are approved, I will combine shipping from
>>>>> Baltic to save money.
>>>>>
>>>>> --Bart
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> Ryan Turner
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> http://mail.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>
>
> --
>
> Ryan Turner
>
>
>
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