[HamWAN PSDR] Lookout maintenance update

[Kenny Richards]

I uploaded all the pictures I took on Saturday, but wanted to share two in
particular to explain why the Triangle PtP had gone off line.

https://www.ku7m.net/drop/Hardline-PullCAT5-Arrows.jpg

Red Arrow - That is the hardline which had pulled the CAT5 almost a foot
from the cable tray.
Orange Arrow - This is where the hardline and another coax had managed to
wrap themselves around the ladder, ensuring there was consistent tension on
the CAT5
Blue Arrow - This is the hanger which 'used' to hold the hardline/coax. The
rubber cushion was long gone.

https://www.ku7m.net/drop/Triangle-CAT5Hanger2.jpg

The result was two of the CAT5 hangers had been completely pulled out and
the CAT5 was floating with the cushions still on it. No idea where the
hangers went, but the mounts were still on the tower.

I ended up pulling the hardline and coax back to where it was supposed to
be on the cable tray, zip-tied the whole mess back into their broken hanger
clamp. I routed the new CAT5 runs on the tower side of all the
coax/hardline runs and added another mount/cushion hanger at each point
where it transitioned from the cable tray to the antennas.

Thanks
Kenny

On Sat, Oct 28, 2023 at 9:40 PM Dale Skyllingstad <
dskyllingstad at harbornet.com> wrote:

> Yes, we were lucky!  A few years ago we had a similar thing happen at
> Bawfaw.  Bart and I made a winter trip to the mountain top to find at least
> one PoE injector had water ingress corrosion to the point of failure.  We
> did the "strip an inch of jacket at the low point" fix, crimped on new
> RJ45s and replaced the injector.  Still operational years later.  One of
> these summers, we need to climb the Bawfaw tower and assess any cat cable
> damage that allowed the water ingress in the first place.  Cable dressing
> at the bottom of the tower could use some work as well.
>
>
> I know a little while back, we talked about testing the Truecable direct
> burial CAT5E with water-blocking tape.  If I recall, it was a little too
> big to fit in our standard 6mm 10-hole barrel cushions.  Did we decide
> against it?
>
>
> Dale
>
> AH6ET
> -------- Original message --------
> From: Rob Salsgiver <rob at nr3o.com>
> Date: 10/28/23 9:02 PM (GMT-08:00)
> To: 'Bart Kus' <me at bartk.us>, 'Puget Sound Data Ring' <psdr at hamwan.org>
> Subject: Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Lookout maintenance update
>
>
> I definitely agree it has benefits as a revised standard to future
> installs and/or retrofits.  In this case we didn't have water reach and
> wick into the RJ45 terminations, so we were lucky this time.  Might be
> something to put on the next visit list.
>
>
>
> Thanks for sharing.
>
>
>
> Rob
>
>
>
> *From:* Bart Kus <me at bartk.us>
> *Sent:* Saturday, October 28, 2023 8:55 PM
> *To:* Rob Salsgiver <rob at nr3o.com>; 'Puget Sound Data Ring' <
> psdr at hamwan.org>
> *Subject:* Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Lookout maintenance update
>
>
>
> The key difference is the lack of RJ45 termination on the cable coming
> down the tower.  If you don't give the water somewhere to go, it'll go
> right into the RJ45 fingers and with PoE on there, it'll corrode and
> short/open in no time.  The punchdown blocks let it drip down without
> touching any copper.  One can also remove the jacket, and shield, and
> plastic film from the cable to let it drip before an RJ45, but I found that
> to be cumbersome to do, ugly looking and fragile.
>
> --Bart
>
>
> On 10/28/2023 8:51 PM, Rob Salsgiver wrote:
>
> In the case of Lookout, the incoming CAT cables went into the bottom of
> the lightning protection similar to your picture at Haystack.  Once the
> jackets of the CAT cables were compromised up above, the water rode down
> the jackets clear inside the building.  Ironically the lightning protection
> wasn't affected, as the excess cable looped inside and upward entry into
> the lightning protection served to stop/slow the path of the water.  It was
> mostly when the cables were unplugged and left to hang that the water
> started dripping out.  It could have been worse.  The hardline that broke
> free up above did a pretty serious number on the CAT cables, stretching
> them and allowing them to abrade on the angle iron / etc.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rob
>
>
>
> *From:* Bart Kus <me at bartk.us> <me at bartk.us>
> *Sent:* Saturday, October 28, 2023 8:38 PM
> *To:* Puget Sound Data Ring <psdr at hamwan.org> <psdr at hamwan.org>; Rob
> Salsgiver <rob at nr3o.com> <rob at nr3o.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Lookout maintenance update
>
>
>
> Water water everywhere!  New water drainage devices have been installed @
> Haystack.  May be useful elsewhere.  Surprised to hear SnoDEM was
> affected.  Those cables are really well supported.
>
>
> --Bart
>
>
> On 10/28/2023 6:27 PM, Rob Salsgiver wrote:
>
> The maintenance at Lookout is complete.
>
>
>
> Problems found on inspection include:
>
>    1. PTP link to Triangle (only one operating) had an abrasion in the
>    CAT5E jacket up next to the dish.  This link has been intermittent, causing
>    the site to go up and down repeatedly, most notably during periods of rain.
>    2. PTP link to SnoDEM was found to have significant damage to the
>    CAT5E jacket toward the upper end where it runs from the main cableway out
>    to the dish.
>    3. Sector 2 is offline (more on this below)
>
>
>
> The cause of the damage to both PTP link CAT cables was due to another
> tenant's antenna hardline had become detached from it's mountings and fell
> toward the inside of the tower, stretching both CAT cables and damaging
> them.
>
>
>
> New CAT cables were pulled for both Triangle and SnoDEM PTP dishes and the
> site is stable once again and fed from both sources.
>
>
>
> Sector 2 is still down, as we simply could not get to it on this trip.  S2
> is substantially higher on the tower and after the first two antennas were
> corrected the call was made to stop there due to fatigue and waning
> daylight.  It is unlikely that S2 will be fixed before winter, but it
> should be able to be done as soon as an opening allows in the spring.
>
>
>
> While we didn't go up to examine the cable, it was leaking water through
> the jacket down at the tower base just like the Triangle and SnoDEM PTP
> dishes were, so it likely shares the same root cause.
>
>
>
> Apologies we weren't able to get S2 done, but at least it looks to be
> cabling instead of a hardware issue.  For now S2 has been unplugged at the
> lightning arrestor.
>
>
>
> Thanks to Kenny Richards, Scott Honaker, and Jim Irving for joining me to
> help make this all happen.   We were fortunate to luck into likely the last
> weather opening for the season.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rob Salsgiver – NR3O
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> PSDR mailing list
>
> PSDR at hamwan.org
>
> https://mail01.fmt.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr
>
>
> -------- Original message --------From: Rob Salsgiver <rob at nr3o.com>
> Date: 10/28/23  9:02 PM  (GMT-08:00) To: 'Bart Kus' <me at bartk.us>, 'Puget
> Sound Data Ring' <psdr at hamwan.org> Subject: Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Lookout
> maintenance update I definitely agree it has benefits as a revised standard
> to future installs and/or retrofits.  In this case we didn't have water
> reach and wick into the RJ45 terminations, so we were lucky this time.
> Might be something to put on the next visit list. Thanks for
> sharing. Rob From: Bart Kus <me at bartk.us> Sent: Saturday, October 28,
> 2023 8:55 PMTo: Rob Salsgiver <rob at nr3o.com>; 'Puget Sound Data Ring' <
> psdr at hamwan.org>Subject: Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Lookout maintenance update The
> key difference is the lack of RJ45 termination on the cable coming down the
> tower.  If you don't give the water somewhere to go, it'll go right into
> the RJ45 fingers and with PoE on there, it'll corrode and short/open in no
> time.  The punchdown blocks let it drip down without touching any copper.
> One can also remove the jacket, and shield, and plastic film from the cable
> to let it drip before an RJ45, but I found that to be cumbersome to do,
> ugly looking and fragile.--Bart On 10/28/2023 8:51 PM, Rob Salsgiver
> wrote:In the case of Lookout, the incoming CAT cables went into the bottom
> of the lightning protection similar to your picture at Haystack.  Once the
> jackets of the CAT cables were compromised up above, the water rode down
> the jackets clear inside the building.  Ironically the lightning protection
> wasn't affected, as the excess cable looped inside and upward entry into
> the lightning protection served to stop/slow the path of the water.  It was
> mostly when the cables were unplugged and left to hang that the water
> started dripping out.  It could have been worse.  The hardline that broke
> free up above did a pretty serious number on the CAT cables, stretching
> them and allowing them to abrade on the angle iron / etc. Cheers,Rob From:
> Bart Kus <me at bartk.us> Sent: Saturday, October 28, 2023 8:38 PMTo: Puget
> Sound Data Ring <psdr at hamwan.org>; Rob Salsgiver <rob at nr3o.com>Subject:
> Re: [HamWAN PSDR] Lookout maintenance update Water water everywhere!  New
> water drainage devices have been installed @ Haystack.  May be useful
> elsewhere.  Surprised to hear SnoDEM was affected.  Those cables are really
> well supported.--Bart On 10/28/2023 6:27 PM, Rob Salsgiver wrote:The
> maintenance at Lookout is complete. Problems found on inspection
> include:PTP link to Triangle (only one operating) had an abrasion in the
> CAT5E jacket up next to the dish.  This link has been intermittent, causing
> the site to go up and down repeatedly, most notably during periods of
> rain.PTP link to SnoDEM was found to have significant damage to the CAT5E
> jacket toward the upper end where it runs from the main cableway out to the
> dish.Sector 2 is offline (more on this below) The cause of the damage to
> both PTP link CAT cables was due to another tenant's antenna hardline had
> become detached from it's mountings and fell toward the inside of the
> tower, stretching both CAT cables and damaging them. New CAT cables were
> pulled for both Triangle and SnoDEM PTP dishes and the site is stable once
> again and fed from both sources. Sector 2 is still down, as we simply could
> not get to it on this trip.  S2 is substantially higher on the tower and
> after the first two antennas were corrected the call was made to stop there
> due to fatigue and waning daylight.  It is unlikely that S2 will be fixed
> before winter, but it should be able to be done as soon as an opening
> allows in the spring. While we didn't go up to examine the cable, it was
> leaking water through the jacket down at the tower base just like the
> Triangle and SnoDEM PTP dishes were, so it likely shares the same root
> cause.   Apologies we weren't able to get S2 done, but at least it looks to
> be cabling instead of a hardware issue.  For now S2 has been unplugged at
> the lightning arrestor. Thanks to Kenny Richards, Scott Honaker, and Jim
> Irving for joining me to help make this all happen.   We were fortunate to
> luck into likely the last weather opening for the season. Cheers,Rob
> Salsgiver – NR3O_______________________________________________PSDR mailing
> listPSDR at hamwan.orghttps://mail01.fmt.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr
> _______________________________________________
> PSDR mailing list
> PSDR at hamwan.org
> https://mail01.fmt.hamwan.net/mailman/listinfo/psdr
>
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